withnail Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 As with everything you do OT thanks.The information I've gained from yourself and a few others on this site has been invaluble and continues to be so. Just a quicky I'm about to start another grow soon and locally it is much easier to source westlands+JI as opposed to JAB+JI. Is it a similar compost? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer1 Posted October 21, 2007 Author Share Posted October 21, 2007 Just a quicky I'm about to start another grow soon and locally it is much easier to source westlands+JI as opposed to JAB+JI. Is it a similar compost? If you go back to the start of this topic, it is about a search for a replacement of westlands mp + JI. Did I find it, answer no, the old version of westlands mp + JI was the best all round compost for growing puff. The bud from JAB + JI is not as good as the westlands, yield is on parr. Carrs produces better bud than either but is not as easy to use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
withnail Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 Just a quicky I'm about to start another grow soon and locally it is much easier to source westlands+JI as opposed to JAB+JI. Is it a similar compost? If you go back to the start of this topic, it is about a search for a replacement of westlands mp + JI. Did I find it, answer no, the old version of westlands mp + JI was the best all round compost for growing puff. The bud from JAB + JI is not as good as the westlands, yield is on parr. Carrs produces better bud than either but is not as easy to use. Aha, thanks again OT.I read westlands but missed the fact that it had changed formula Best go hunting for some JAB+JI then B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davey Jones Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 How far behind the westlands is the carrs is it massive differences How come they stopped making it as good its strange Don't you make your own compost OT that beats the old westlands Is the new westlands really that bad like behind all of these three Good info OT Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dr rockster Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 Just a quicky I'm about to start another grow soon and locally it is much easier to source westlands+JI as opposed to JAB+JI. Is it a similar compost? If you go back to the start of this topic, it is about a search for a replacement of westlands mp + JI. Did I find it, answer no, the old version of westlands mp + JI was the best all round compost for growing puff. The bud from JAB + JI is not as good as the westlands, yield is on parr. Carrs produces better bud than either but is not as easy to use. With respect Ot1,what actually do you mean by 'better bud'? As regards compost,its an environment in which to grow pot,and some will be more condusive to giving a plant and its rootzone the nutrients it needs more than others,but surely(Blimey I can already feel the ice cracking)the main thing about any plant is the genotype,the genetics within that seed grown,yes? So when a ganga farmer grows pot on marginal land but with good original genetics,surely he gets the same result as a farmer down the road growing on more fertile soil which will produce larger plants but surely will produce the same cannabinoid profile as the guy whose plants will be smaller but surely the pot will be the same? In fact,could it not be said that the guy farming on marginal stuff but still gets a result may have a 'stress induced cannabinoid profile' that may be more desireable overall to canna grown in an(sorry)easy peasy environment? I don't believe the last sentence could be true which is why I am asking you this question? Bottom line,my question is how can say 2 identical clones grown in different compost be 'better' than the other? One may be friendlier to good growth than the other,but if both finish properly and are compared,one may have a better yield,maybe have more resin,more trich production than another,but ultimately the resin(looking from my unenlightened but I hope logical view)would be the same? Rockster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Petrelli Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 Cheers for posting up the results OT1, been waiting to hear those for a minute now.... and not a moment to soon either.... started off some plants in allmix, while waiting to hear the results of your trial. Looks like I'll be seeking out some Carr then eh?! Never seen the stuff about in my local garden centres, guess I gotta do some more diggin no pun intended ) Thanks man.... peace & blessings to ya! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer1 Posted October 21, 2007 Author Share Posted October 21, 2007 EM2 Yes I used to make my own loam based compost, I’m getting old, have arthritis, a heart condition etc. I am just am not capable of doing it any more. As far as shop bought, the old westlands was the best all round compost out of the bag for growing I have tried, in my opinion Carrs produces better quality buds, but great care with watering is needed. Ask Pro_Liberate about the new formula westlands, or read his topic on it. There is a big difference between a really good compost and most of the composts sold in garden centres. Doc have you ever heard of terroir? All I can say is the different composts in the same enviroment produced different looking, smelling, structured and tasting buds useing identicle clones, even the complexity of the high is different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer1 Posted October 21, 2007 Author Share Posted October 21, 2007 Cheers for posting up the results OT1, been waiting to hear those for a minute now.... and not a moment to soon either.... started off some plants in allmix, while waiting to hear the results of your trial. Looks like I'll be seeking out some Carr then eh?!Never seen the stuff about in my local garden centres, guess I gotta do some more diggin no pun intended ) Thanks man.... peace & blessings to ya! Its made by a small organic producer in Glostershire, I got mine from a garden centre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbuscule Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 Firstly, thank you for conducting this trial. I am sure that your effort is appreciated. Most enlightening. If I werent seeking to grow as 'organically' as possible I would switch to JAB with John Innes. At least, that was my view untill the last couple of pages; now I'm intrigued by identical clones producing the diffarences that have been described. This is setting all sorts of reflections in motion... Fascinating stuff, thank you, Regards, Arbuscule 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Dzerzhinsky Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 Very interesting results indeed OT, many thanks for spending the time to conduct the tests. Although the Carrs has the worst structure, could possibly get water logged and had the worst root development yet it produced the best buds and all testers agreed the best smoke. With all the disadvantages listed it still brings in the best results, what would you say is the reason for this OT ? Would it be some of the ingredients inside the Carrs that give it the edge even though in other areas it's somewhat less than ideal. If we can identify these elements then perhaps they could be incorporated into another compost with better structure ? Felix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer1 Posted October 21, 2007 Author Share Posted October 21, 2007 Hmm I’m not a scientist, but like to experiment. The word terroir has no meaning in english yet every french farmer understands it. My definition is something unique about a particular place, its soil and micro climate. Its enough so in France two fields next to one another, the wine from one fetches a few pounds and the other tens or hundreds a bottle. On some estates this part of the field produces a wine who's characteristics are so different to the rest of the field that it is picked and fermented separately. Same grape var, same pruning. Its evident on our allotment in a small way as well, my kestrel potatoes taste and cook differently to those grown on a plot a 100 ft away, same seed potatoes, apparently the same soil type, same cultivation methods, both grown organically. I can only assume its down to a variation in the soil minerals, crumb structure, humus content, who knows. But we both agree that the same differences have existed for many many years and are consistent year after year. Kestrel potatoes grown on different soils at a friend organic farm just north of Monmouth are totally different again. Why do soils change the flavour, texture, cooking profile of a simple potato, I just don’t know the answer to that question but they just do. Any gardener who has grow vegetables for any length of time in more than one place will know this is true. So what is it about Carrs compost? Answer I don’t have a clue, in it, plants were slightly slower growing, not as sturdy, but yielded really well. To me its a bit of a mystery. I do believe that there is a lot more to what a plant produces than N:P:K and the few other minerals that are said to be all a plant needs. Plants take up many minerals that are said to have absolutely no value to them. Maybe they do have values. They say about the Carrs compost:- A natural multi-purpose compost which will sustain vigorous growth over a long period. Based on earth worm digested manure plus three organic manures; bone meal, hoof and horn and calcified seaweed. I have to say its ingredients are unlike any other compost I have come across, it has what look like to me bits of crushed rose quartz in it as well, I don’t like the texture its so unlike any thing I have tried before. Maybe I’m prejudiced! It goes against what all previous experience has taught me, on decanting the compost for disposal I remove the roots, I would say the Carrs plants probably only had a little more than half the root mass of the Genie plants, even so it produced nearly double the yield of Genie. Experince says plants with big root mass produce big yields, not this time. I can’t explain why, but the scales, bud quality and the smoke test all comfirm it has done what I think it should not, I can only report on what I found. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazyhead Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 Oz Clarke spent one of his programmes trying to explain Terrior to his co-presenter James May and the effect it has on the end product of wine and the differences it produces. I think that you have explained it pretty much the same as Oz Clarke and the french wine producing farmers certainly attribute importance to terrior with pieces of wine producing land side by side but with huge variations in price simply because the terroir was better in one field than the one next to it. Again thankyou Oldtimer1 for the interesting read. Hh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Dzerzhinsky Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 Once again OT thank you for taking the time to explain this. I'm going to have to think about this one for a bit as there's some pretty deep concepts there and somewhat contrary to expectations, ie large root ball = big harvest. I'm glad I also saw Oz Clarke explaining the concept as it wasn't something I'd ever come across before and I hadn't thought of extending it beyond Wine but it does make perfect sense. Like I say, this is going to take some thinking over. Thanks OT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dr rockster Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 (edited) Thanks for you answer Ot1,it really surprises me no end that that is the case. Ill be looking for Westlands compo most definately after what you've told me. If I do that will also innoculate with beneficials as I'm coming to realise just how beneficial they in fact are. But terroir? I'm afraid I havent a clue what that is? Sorry,Ot1,just saw your explanation of it. Edited October 21, 2007 by dr rockster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 Thanks a lot for this OT1, very interesting as usual Redgrotto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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