Split from pedophile priest thread

[Bill Dick]

talking of monster slayers ...richard dawkins ...last week was saying he was going to arrest the pope ..are we to believe richard has suddenly become concerned for children being attacked by pedophiles ..or is it more likely he's unashamedly using the victims to promote his own evangelical stance as an anti-religionist ..thats how I see these articles ...the way they are put together has nothing to do with protecting children ...a political/power football

One of Dawkins' ket objections to religion is the way children are indoctrinated into faith by their parents. To illustrate the point he lists: Jewish child, Muslim child, Catholic child, Protestant child, Communist child, Nazi child. Why are the last two any more shocking than the first four in this list?

In his book 'The God Delusion' he's written an entire chapter on this subject, so to accuse him of cynically cashing in on paedophilia is pretty sick.

[weed_G]

One of Dawkins' ket objections to religion is the way children are indoctrinated into faith by their parents. To illustrate the point he lists: Jewish child, Muslim child, Catholic child, Protestant child, Communist child, Nazi child. Why are the last two any more shocking than the first four in this list?

can I ask what happens when you add Atheist child and Materialist child to the list?

Edited April 14, 2010 by weed_G

[Eddiesilence]

One of Dawkins' ket objections to religion is the way children are indoctrinated into faith by their parents. To illustrate the point he lists: Jewish child, Muslim child, Catholic child, Protestant child, Communist child, Nazi child. Why are the last two any more shocking than the first four in this list?

can I ask what happens when you add Atheist child and Materialist child to the list?

It seems to be the same deal, in that a child can't be any of the above until s/he has the faculties and information to figure out where s/he's at.

Stop press: apparently, a new theory from a certain Catholic elite is that the Jews are to blame:

Bishop 'blames Jews' for criticism of Catholic church record on abuse

A furious transatlantic row has erupted over quotes that were attributed to a retired Italian bishop, which suggested that Jews were behind the current criticism of the Catholic church's record on tackling clerical sex abuse.

A website quoted Giacomo Babini, the emeritus bishop of Grosseto, as saying he believed a "Zionist attack" was behind the criticism, considering how "powerful and refined" the criticism is.

The comments, which have been denied by the bishop, follow a series of statements from Catholic churchmen alleging the existence of plots to weaken the church and Pope Benedict XVI...

hxxp://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/apr/11/catholic-bishop-blames-jews

[Arnold Layne]

Dawkins, the pope, what's the difference?

Dwakins needs to take a rest. He's as fanatical and dominating as any religionist. He's just a fundamentalist evangelical atheist, is all. As dangerous as any zealous religious fanatic IMHO.

[weed_G]

sup ed,

can I ask what happens when you add Atheist child and Materialist child to the list?

It seems to be the same deal, in that a child can't be any of the above until s/he has the faculties and information to figure out where s/he's at.

by the time they get the necessary faculties and information...kids are pretty much already hard wired to think a certain way ..iow the foundations of their soon-to-be world view have already been established..just a case of joining the dots and filling in the blanks ..this is the same for any child growing up in the environment of any belief system

Edited April 15, 2010 by weed_G

[troy]

I can't see how bringing up a child in an atheist family is indoctrination. There is essentially one basic premise : that god does not exist or possibly the agnostic view that we can't know one way or another whether there is a god. It is not a set of beliefs or values that are drummed into the child and I would expect that the view could be challenged. In fact I would say that in many cases children in atheist families are actively brought up to question beliefs and values. When a child is indoctrinated they are discouraged from questioning the ideas they are given. What is the doctrine of atheism ?

Generally atheism is a more healthy approach to bringing up children as it allows them room to think for themselves provided it is accompanied by a loving family.

eta

Dawkins, the pope, what's the difference?

One of them protects kiddy fiddlers.

Edited April 15, 2010 by troy

[sam-i-am]

spot on

Dawkins, the pope, what's the difference?

Dwakins needs to take a rest. He's as fanatical and dominating as any religionist. He's just a fundamentalist evangelical atheist, is all. As dangerous as any zealous religious fanatic IMHO.

[weed_G]

What is the doctrine of atheism ?

There is essentially one basic premise : that god does not exist

---

It is not a set of beliefs or values that are drummed into the child

in many cases children in atheist families are actively brought up to....

-----

parents are only part of the programming ..many young children spend hours everyday meditating on the 'all knowing/pervading' oscillating monolith, installed as a shrine in their homes as standard ..when the telepathic connection to the monolith is made the child enters a deep trance, the conscious part of the brain is disengaged to further facilitate transmission of insights and values

[troy]

What is the doctrine of atheism ?

There is essentially one basic premise : that god does not exist

---

It is not a set of beliefs or values that are drummed into the child

in many cases children in atheist families are actively brought up to....

-----

parents are only part of the programming ..many young children spend hours everyday meditating on the 'all knowing/pervading' oscillating monolith, installed as a shrine in their homes as standard ..when the telepathic connection to the monolith is made the child enters a deep trance, the conscious part of the brain is disengaged to further facilitate transmission of insights and values

Hi weed, i'm not sure what your point is and how it is connected to atheism, would you care to elaborate further. cheers

[weed_G]

sry troy ..maybe this is clearer

What is the doctrine of atheism ?

There is essentially one basic premise : that god does not exist

doc·trine (dktrn)

n.

1. A principle or body of principles presented for acceptance or belief, as by a religious, political, scientific, or philosophic group; dogma.[/b]

2. A rule or principle of law, especially when established by precedent.

3. A statement of official government policy, especially in foreign affairs and military strategy.

4. Archaic Something taught; a teaching.

[internewt]

One of Dawkins' ket objections to religion is the way children are indoctrinated into faith by their parents. To illustrate the point he lists: Jewish child, Muslim child, Catholic child, Protestant child, Communist child, Nazi child. Why are the last two any more shocking than the first four in this list?

can I ask what happens when you add Atheist child and Materialist child to the list?

Atheists do not practice belief and faith like theists, conspiracy theorists, etc.. The word atheism is used mainly because those who do view the world through systems of faith are unable to comprehend what non-faith is. So a parallel to faith is created to provide a one-word description of something that the faithful would never grasp even with a million words. [1]

Atheism is a belief system like not collecting stamps is a hobby. That sentence shouldn't make much sense, but then nor does trying to look at logic and reason from a position of faith..

[1] Obviously sweeping generalisations are not totally accurate. Though they are generally.

[troy]

This is from the Oxford English dictionary :

Doctrine :

a set of beliefs or principles held and taught by a church, political party or other group.

It would be a very poor doctrine that only had one belief ! I think the generally accepted definition is a collection of beliefs as in christianity.

eta Stunning post internewt !

Edited April 15, 2010 by troy

[~nobody~]

Dawkins, the pope, what's the difference?

Dwakins needs to take a rest. He's as fanatical and dominating as any religionist. He's just a fundamentalist evangelical atheist, is all. As dangerous as any zealous religious fanatic IMHO.

While I agree with most of what you say I'd have to disagree with your last sentence. I don't think fundamentalist atheists (inasmuch as that phrase has any meaning) are anywhere near the danger that religious zealots are, at least in our current society. In the face of the institutions of established religion people like Dawkins are just a voice shouting in the wind, if they have to resort to hyperbole it's generally just to make themselves heard.

[Guest Logik]

Dawkins, the pope, what's the difference?

Dwakins needs to take a rest. He's as fanatical and dominating as any religionist. He's just a fundamentalist evangelical atheist, is all. As dangerous as any zealous religious fanatic IMHO.

While I agree with most of what you say I'd have to disagree with your last sentence. I don't think fundamentalist atheists (inasmuch as that phrase has any meaning) are anywhere near the danger that religious zealots are, at least in our current society. In the face of the institutions of established religion people like Dawkins are just a voice shouting in the wind, if they have to resort to hyperbole it's generally just to make themselves heard.

Fundamentalist Evangelicals sacrifice children in countries in the african continent, as dangerous or even more then religious zealots

If I shout in the wind, the person next to me will hear it, they shout to and the person next to them hear it

Edited April 15, 2010 by Logik

[Arnold Layne]

Atheists do not practice belief and faith like theists, conspiracy theorists, etc..

Mmmkay.

But I beg to differ.

I don't think fundamentalist atheists (inasmuch as that phrase has any meaning) are anywhere near the danger that religious zealots are

I think they may be worse, actually.

Fundamentalist Evangelicals sacrifice children in countries in the african continent

Source material, please. That's a truly massive claim/accusation, and needs real substantiation, not just chatter.