Trichoderma Harzianum & Vesicular Arbuscular Mycorrhizas

[Randalizer]

Great discussion folks. Thanks to everyone for contributing.

[Guest Mr P]

Hi guys,

Webbys sending me some essence but I've got a question about the air pump used to fully activate it.

I'm going to go and buy one tomorrow from the fish shop, the ones I've seen with 2 outputs like the one pro libertate shows, are much more powerful than the single ones, is this going to be OK if there more powerful, or could I make do with a lower powered single output one with a t piece on? If its best I'll get the more powerful one, just don't know what one to get.

[Randalizer]

my advice is try to get a quiet one. They can be quite noisy and annoying. You can always buy another pump if you need one.

eta: I wouldn't worry about power really.

Edited August 20, 2008 by Randalizer

[Felix Dzerzhinsky]

Depends on the size of the vessel you are brewing it in. For a 10 litre bottle either a single or double output would do the job, I use a single output pump with two airstones on a T-piece. Doesn't really matter which one you get but if you get the more powerful one you can always limit how much air gets to the airstone, like Randalizer says noise is probably more important

[scraglor]

If allmix contains rock dust, its not enough, the addition of more improves it out of sight, allmix may contain some micro heard, whatever it contains is of little use to plants, ie I don't think they are beneficial. The addition of mycorrhizal spoors to allmix when potting on also makes it a much better compost.

this is the spiel for pre-mix

"Pre-mix mixture of organic fertilizers was developed especially for organic cultivation. You can use it to create your own mixture of potting soil at low costs, or to make your potting soil reusable indefinitely. Pre-mix combines the qualities of about ten different organic fertilizers, rock meals, trace elements and fungi in such quantities that optimum growth and flowering and maximum resistance to diseases and fungi are guarantee"

not disagreeing with you in the slightest, this is just what i'd read

[Felix Dzerzhinsky]

this is the spiel for pre-mix

"Pre-mix mixture of organic fertilizers was developed especially for organic cultivation. You can use it to create your own mixture of potting soil at low costs, or to make your potting soil reusable indefinitely. Pre-mix combines the qualities of about ten different organic fertilizers, rock meals, trace elements and fungi in such quantities that optimum growth and flowering and maximum resistance to diseases and fungi are guarantee"

not disagreeing with you in the slightest, this is just what i'd read

Think I might be missing your point man ?

Edited August 21, 2008 by felix_dzerjinski
spelling

[oldtimer1]

I’ve used biobizz products since the very early days, ie back when there were only a couple of outlets in the uk, it was easier at that time to take a van over to Jertz farm, It was all very laid back, in those days, selling organic sundries from a barn on his farm was a sort of an on the side business. Out of this the huge biobizz entity of today was born.

I know what they say about pre mix and all mix that has pre mix as a base. From the occasions of watching people loosing plants and having sick grows that it later turned out to be root problems, I concluded that protection, if any was negligible. The reliability of allmix has been very variable over the years, the worst period was when they first took the manufacture back into house.

I have been using premix for many years and from my personal experiences it has been consistent and the best organic compost base fertiliser for me to date. I don’t think it contains any mycorrhizals, I don’t know about trichodermas either, but if you add cultures of either or both to the plants roots when you pot up you get improved health and studier root systems against uninoculated plants. The cost of this is minimal compared to the difference made by even one sick plant.

When I test things, I try and do 9 or more controls against the same amount using what ever treatment or addition is being tried using identical and as near matched clones as I can. I’m not into selling or promoting anything, if what I try does nothing or has a negative effect, I say so and that is not popular, I tested top max using 24 plants treated as recommended and 24 fed as normal, there was virtually no difference in yield between the two groups, I gave over 20 smoke testers, blind a/b samples, all but a couple preferred the untreated samples grown with just bb grow and bloom, with comments like this one tastes nicer, or is less acrid, the other one made me cough. So I reported about it here, at the time we had people from bb here and I got a lot os shit for saying what I did. Since then other people have concluded the same thing. My opinion of top max is still the same, is it worth 17 or 18 quid a litre, no.

I got a really nasty PM from the owner of B.A.C Products because he did not like my report on his grow and bloom against, Biosevia and Biobizz’s products, all I did was report on yield and what people said about a/b/c samples.

From what I can make out, he said I should have used all the products, not just organic grow and bloom. From his POV I should have been also using their Organic Root Stimulator, Organic Bloom Stimulator, Foliar Spray, Organic PK 13/14 and final solution.

I was testing grow and bloom fertilisers, IMHO thats all you should need.

I understand you are not disagreeing with me scraglor but, so you understand where I am coming from, what I write comes mostly from my personal experiences from the grow room and gardening in general. One conclusion I have drawn is you cannot rely on what any manufacturer say about their products, especially when those manufacturers make their living almost exclusively supplying a black economy.

[Felix Dzerzhinsky]

Mycorrhizal fungi need to form a symbiotic relationship with living roots within a very short time after germination. If they don't they die so I think it somewhat unlikely that Pre-Mix will contain mycorrhizal fungi, even as spores because they would germinate in a moist environment.

[Guest Mr P]

Depends on the size of the vessel you are brewing it in. For a 10 litre bottle either a single or double output would do the job, I use a single output pump with two airstones on a T-piece. Doesn't really matter which one you get but if you get the more powerful one you can always limit how much air gets to the airstone, like Randalizer says noise is probably more important

Thanks guys, off shopping tomorrow, thanks for your help

[scraglor]

this is the spiel for pre-mix

"Pre-mix mixture of organic fertilizers was developed especially for organic cultivation. You can use it to create your own mixture of potting soil at low costs, or to make your potting soil reusable indefinitely. Pre-mix combines the qualities of about ten different organic fertilizers, rock meals, trace elements and fungi in such quantities that optimum growth and flowering and maximum resistance to diseases and fungi are guarantee"

not disagreeing with you in the slightest, this is just what i'd read

Think I might be missing your point man ?

it was directed at ot felix, as i said earlier to someone about allmix allready containing, fungi, rock dust etc

[squinted]

Hi all,

Great thread this.. I put a gram of trichoderma into 20 litres of water about a month ago.. There's a fairly cheap centrifugal pump in there.

The reservoir has never been totally emptied since then. Assuming ideal conditions should I expect that the trichoderma is still in there?

[Felix Dzerzhinsky]

Hi all,

Great thread this.. I put a gram of trichoderma into 20 litres of water about a month ago.. There's a fairly cheap centrifugal pump in there.

The reservoir has never been totally emptied since then. Assuming ideal conditions should I expect that the trichoderma is still in there?

Is that in hydro or compost ?

[I Zimbra]

Hi all,

Great thread this.. I put a gram of trichoderma into 20 litres of water about a month ago.. There's a fairly cheap centrifugal pump in there.

The reservoir has never been totally emptied since then. Assuming ideal conditions should I expect that the trichoderma is still in there?

Is that in hydro or compost ?

good point

[squinted]

Hi all,

Great thread this.. I put a gram of trichoderma into 20 litres of water about a month ago.. There's a fairly cheap centrifugal pump in there.

The reservoir has never been totally emptied since then. Assuming ideal conditions should I expect that the trichoderma is still in there?

Is that in hydro or compost ?

Oh, I'm using compost.. I just have a bin for my water, and take my water out of it as I need it

[Trychs]

This threads getting more interesting by the day with all the innoculants, teas and remedies out there .

I haven't seen chitosan mentioned here though, I believe that Gunnaknow brought it up a year or so ago and its very promising stuff.

Its on of the main enzymes that trichoderma sends out to hunt around for pathogens in the soil (or on the leaves I presume) and once it finds some it mass produces it as chitosan destroys the cell walls of some of the nastier fungi allowing the tricho to ingest it.

Chitosan also gets detected by the plant itself and warns it that theres a fungal battle going on so it activates its own defence system too (works best in low nitrogen situ's) and can be applied either by foliar, direct watering or as a (preventative) seed soak.

I use it all the time as a seed soak now as I've always believed that prevention is better than cure and no longer seem to have any fungal issues. I don't know if its the definitive answer to lsf but its helped me and is I believe worth a mention on the thread.